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	<title>Comments on: Moodle Security, Censorship, and Trust &#8212; An Observation</title>
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	<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/</link>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention Free Technology Tutorials » Moodle Security, Censorship, and Trust — An Observation -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-31851</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention Free Technology Tutorials » Moodle Security, Censorship, and Trust — An Observation -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Dec 2010 12:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-31851</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Julian Ridden and Dan Humpherson, Figaro. Figaro said: Moodle Security, Censorship, and Trust -- An... http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Julian Ridden and Dan Humpherson, Figaro. Figaro said: Moodle Security, Censorship, and Trust &#8212; An&#8230; <a href="http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/" rel="nofollow">http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: all things moodle&#8230; &#124; MLE Review</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-26649</link>
		<dc:creator>all things moodle&#8230; &#124; MLE Review</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Mar 2010 15:05:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-26649</guid>
		<description>[...] the following url was also sent to me recently, also on Moodle.  bath, moodle Today at 3:01 pm   Leave a Reply or [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the following url was also sent to me recently, also on Moodle.  bath, moodle Today at 3:01 pm   Leave a Reply or [...]</p>
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		<title>By: figaro</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-25207</link>
		<dc:creator>figaro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Feb 2010 13:40:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-25207</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-24753&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@netbuoy &lt;/a&gt; 
&lt;blockquote&gt;And, indeed, but for the risk of posting that which is private I would so have done…. And I will so post – you know who you are ;) Resend copy clearly identified for posting here and I will make common cause with your efforts to be heard here, whatever measures may be de jure chez moodle.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Just to close the loop here 9 days later, I&#039;ll state one fact and one assumption:

Fact: You haven&#039;t posted the correspondents comment he/she claims wasn&#039;t approved.

Assumption: After calling the correspondent&#039;s bluff you didn&#039;t receive that clear copy with directions to post here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-24753" rel="nofollow">@netbuoy </a> </p>
<blockquote><p>And, indeed, but for the risk of posting that which is private I would so have done…. And I will so post – you know who you are <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  Resend copy clearly identified for posting here and I will make common cause with your efforts to be heard here, whatever measures may be de jure chez moodle.</p></blockquote>
<p>Just to close the loop here 9 days later, I&#8217;ll state one fact and one assumption:</p>
<p>Fact: You haven&#8217;t posted the correspondents comment he/she claims wasn&#8217;t approved.</p>
<p>Assumption: After calling the correspondent&#8217;s bluff you didn&#8217;t receive that clear copy with directions to post here.</p>
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		<title>By: figaro</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24754</link>
		<dc:creator>figaro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 00:14:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24754</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I just received mail charging that Figaro is as guilty of censorship as Helen and that my correspondents attempt to post here was obstructed.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Well, anyone can say anything...doesn&#039;t make it true. I haven&#039;t yet not approved a comment on this topic. Look at the comments here on the &quot;Critical Moodle security vulnerability&quot; post...several comments there that weren&#039;t too flattering of me. Having said that, I owe no one at moodle.com the right to post here, so it doesn&#039;t mean I won&#039;t obstruct their attempt to post here. I don&#039;t claim to be the champion of social constructivism.

Let me tell your correspondent what I am not guilty of.

I&#039;m not guilty of owning and operating a .org, open source community site, where I allow my .com business partners to freely (and exclusively) advertise their wares, allow all members of my site to praise my partners services, allow anyone to recommend my business partners services to the world, allow people to give testimony about what great service they are getting from my business partners, but where I censor anyone who even suggests that my business partners services may not always be as top-notched as they are being told...even if they provide proof.

I wonder what your correspondent would think of my ethics and morals if I operated that kind of site? I wonder if he/she knows anyone who does operate that kind of site? ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I just received mail charging that Figaro is as guilty of censorship as Helen and that my correspondents attempt to post here was obstructed.</p></blockquote>
<p>Well, anyone can say anything&#8230;doesn&#8217;t make it true. I haven&#8217;t yet not approved a comment on this topic. Look at the comments here on the &#8220;Critical Moodle security vulnerability&#8221; post&#8230;several comments there that weren&#8217;t too flattering of me. Having said that, I owe no one at moodle.com the right to post here, so it doesn&#8217;t mean I won&#8217;t obstruct their attempt to post here. I don&#8217;t claim to be the champion of social constructivism.</p>
<p>Let me tell your correspondent what I am not guilty of.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not guilty of owning and operating a .org, open source community site, where I allow my .com business partners to freely (and exclusively) advertise their wares, allow all members of my site to praise my partners services, allow anyone to recommend my business partners services to the world, allow people to give testimony about what great service they are getting from my business partners, but where I censor anyone who even suggests that my business partners services may not always be as top-notched as they are being told&#8230;even if they provide proof.</p>
<p>I wonder what your correspondent would think of my ethics and morals if I operated that kind of site? I wonder if he/she knows anyone who does operate that kind of site? <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: netbuoy</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24753</link>
		<dc:creator>netbuoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 23:23:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24753</guid>
		<description>I get a kick out of open conversation, but I don&#039;t know if I can live with being anomolous ;)

Thoreau was pissed because unbeknownst to him his ass got bailed out... While I don&#039;t know about citing wikipedia as authoritative, they certainly got that right ;=}

But as an anomaly I have to suggest that I find most of what has come out of the mouths of GOP leaders over the last few years painfully inane, irrational, etc. Yet I will always insist that jackasses like Rush and Glenn be afforded freedom of speech in the marketplace of ideas. If people are duped by their pathetic fear mongering it is because, as Hamilton feared, the masses are ignorant and public education has failed its role in preserving democracy.

I abhor ad homina but applaud emerson; I applaud those who speak out on ideas for as we see in the story of the Emperors new clothes, it is the guileless child who may have something to offer; ie credentials do not make or break arguments....

But where am I going with this? I just received mail charging that Figaro is as guilty of censorship as Helen and that my correspondents attempt to post here was obstructed. The mail also suggests that I am asea in the matter. Lastly, the mail challenges me to post the senders remarks here myself.

And, indeed, but for the risk of posting that which is private I would so have done.... And I will so post - you know who you are ;) Resend copy clearly identified for posting here and I will make common cause with your efforts to be heard here, whatever measures may be de jure chez moodle. 

Somber John Donne advised not to send for whom the bell tolls ...... while Dean Swift&#039;s rapier wit sets one&#039;s ears ringing, but both would have agreed with Red Green, &quot;I&#039;m pulling for you. We&#039;re all in this together.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get a kick out of open conversation, but I don&#8217;t know if I can live with being anomolous <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Thoreau was pissed because unbeknownst to him his ass got bailed out&#8230; While I don&#8217;t know about citing wikipedia as authoritative, they certainly got that right ;=}</p>
<p>But as an anomaly I have to suggest that I find most of what has come out of the mouths of GOP leaders over the last few years painfully inane, irrational, etc. Yet I will always insist that jackasses like Rush and Glenn be afforded freedom of speech in the marketplace of ideas. If people are duped by their pathetic fear mongering it is because, as Hamilton feared, the masses are ignorant and public education has failed its role in preserving democracy.</p>
<p>I abhor ad homina but applaud emerson; I applaud those who speak out on ideas for as we see in the story of the Emperors new clothes, it is the guileless child who may have something to offer; ie credentials do not make or break arguments&#8230;.</p>
<p>But where am I going with this? I just received mail charging that Figaro is as guilty of censorship as Helen and that my correspondents attempt to post here was obstructed. The mail also suggests that I am asea in the matter. Lastly, the mail challenges me to post the senders remarks here myself.</p>
<p>And, indeed, but for the risk of posting that which is private I would so have done&#8230;. And I will so post &#8211; you know who you are <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  Resend copy clearly identified for posting here and I will make common cause with your efforts to be heard here, whatever measures may be de jure chez moodle. </p>
<p>Somber John Donne advised not to send for whom the bell tolls &#8230;&#8230; while Dean Swift&#8217;s rapier wit sets one&#8217;s ears ringing, but both would have agreed with Red Green, &#8220;I&#8217;m pulling for you. We&#8217;re all in this together.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: figaro</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24734</link>
		<dc:creator>figaro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 18:35:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24734</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-24716&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@Mauno &lt;/a&gt; 
Hello Mauno. Yes, I&#039;m sure we do have different opinions, but if those opinions are censored, then we will never know just how different, or maybe not-so-different they may be. I don&#039;t understand how you can look at what has happened in the lounge and feel that it was &quot;justified&quot;. Do you really think that initial post should have been deleted? Do you really feel that Marc&#039;s follow-up objections, should have been deleted? Those are rhetorical questions you can ponder while you continue to think about civil disobedience.

If the censorship was limited to those posts, then this could be considered a one-time thing, but in my informed opinion and experience, it&#039;s only one example of a long time systemic problem on moodle.org. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-24716" rel="nofollow">@Mauno </a><br />
Hello Mauno. Yes, I&#8217;m sure we do have different opinions, but if those opinions are censored, then we will never know just how different, or maybe not-so-different they may be. I don&#8217;t understand how you can look at what has happened in the lounge and feel that it was &#8220;justified&#8221;. Do you really think that initial post should have been deleted? Do you really feel that Marc&#8217;s follow-up objections, should have been deleted? Those are rhetorical questions you can ponder while you continue to think about civil disobedience.</p>
<p>If the censorship was limited to those posts, then this could be considered a one-time thing, but in my informed opinion and experience, it&#8217;s only one example of a long time systemic problem on moodle.org. </p>
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		<title>By: Mauno</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24716</link>
		<dc:creator>Mauno</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 14:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24716</guid>
		<description>Steve,

Thank you for that story - I used some days to read Thoreau’s texts and I agree that his writings have influenced many public figures...not only in your home country.

I suppose Defcon knows nothing about my background so it might be good to note that original meaning of that saying about Rome is not so far from ideological ideas of Thoreau:

Ambrose displayed a kind of liturgical flexibility that kept in mind that liturgy was a tool to serve people in worshiping God, and ought not to become a rigid entity that is invariable from place to place. His advice to Augustine of Hippo on this point was to follow local liturgical custom. &quot;When I am at Rome, I fast on a Saturday; when I am at Milan, I do not. Follow the custom of the church where you are.&quot; Thus Ambrose refused to be drawn into a false conflict over which particular local church had the &quot;right&quot; liturgical form where there was no substantial problem. His advice has remained in the English language as the saying, &quot;When in Rome, do as the Romans do.&quot;

Martin Luther King, Jr. noted in his autobiography that his first encounter with the idea of non-violent resistance was reading &quot;On Civil Disobedience&quot;:

Here, in this courageous New Englander&#039;s refusal to pay his taxes and his choice of jail rather than support a war that would spread slavery&#039;s territory into Mexico, I made my first contact with the theory of nonviolent resistance. Fascinated by the idea of refusing to cooperate with an evil system, I was so deeply moved that I reread the work several times.

In my opinion Thoreau&#039;s insistence that evil must be resisted and that no moral man can patiently adjust to injustice was correct - we may just have different personal opinions about meaning of &quot;evil&quot; or &quot;injustice&quot; in public forums or posts

Henry David Thoreau probably never wrote about ranting but following words written by him have been often quoted:

&quot;Goodness is the only investment that never fails.&quot;

&quot;Be true to your work, your word, and your friend.&quot;

&quot;The language of friendship is not words, but meanings. It is an intelligence about language.&quot; 

Best regards,

Mauno</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve,</p>
<p>Thank you for that story &#8211; I used some days to read Thoreau’s texts and I agree that his writings have influenced many public figures&#8230;not only in your home country.</p>
<p>I suppose Defcon knows nothing about my background so it might be good to note that original meaning of that saying about Rome is not so far from ideological ideas of Thoreau:</p>
<p>Ambrose displayed a kind of liturgical flexibility that kept in mind that liturgy was a tool to serve people in worshiping God, and ought not to become a rigid entity that is invariable from place to place. His advice to Augustine of Hippo on this point was to follow local liturgical custom. &#8220;When I am at Rome, I fast on a Saturday; when I am at Milan, I do not. Follow the custom of the church where you are.&#8221; Thus Ambrose refused to be drawn into a false conflict over which particular local church had the &#8220;right&#8221; liturgical form where there was no substantial problem. His advice has remained in the English language as the saying, &#8220;When in Rome, do as the Romans do.&#8221;</p>
<p>Martin Luther King, Jr. noted in his autobiography that his first encounter with the idea of non-violent resistance was reading &#8220;On Civil Disobedience&#8221;:</p>
<p>Here, in this courageous New Englander&#8217;s refusal to pay his taxes and his choice of jail rather than support a war that would spread slavery&#8217;s territory into Mexico, I made my first contact with the theory of nonviolent resistance. Fascinated by the idea of refusing to cooperate with an evil system, I was so deeply moved that I reread the work several times.</p>
<p>In my opinion Thoreau&#8217;s insistence that evil must be resisted and that no moral man can patiently adjust to injustice was correct &#8211; we may just have different personal opinions about meaning of &#8220;evil&#8221; or &#8220;injustice&#8221; in public forums or posts</p>
<p>Henry David Thoreau probably never wrote about ranting but following words written by him have been often quoted:</p>
<p>&#8220;Goodness is the only investment that never fails.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Be true to your work, your word, and your friend.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;The language of friendship is not words, but meanings. It is an intelligence about language.&#8221; </p>
<p>Best regards,</p>
<p>Mauno</p>
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		<title>By: figaro</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24632</link>
		<dc:creator>figaro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 14:04:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24632</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-24630&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@Defcon &lt;/a&gt; 
Well…my Goose-stepping isn’t that great, so looks like I’m out of luck ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-24630" rel="nofollow">@Defcon </a><br />
Well…my Goose-stepping isn’t that great, so looks like I’m out of luck <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Defcon</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24630</link>
		<dc:creator>Defcon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 11:59:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24630</guid>
		<description>Here is your problem figaro. You are quoting Thoreau to people who are clearly challenged by the Sunday comic strips. Heavy reading for MK is The Moodle Users Guide and maybe his Pokemon cards. Using Mauno&#039;s simpleton logic, Thoreau was nothing but an &quot;idiot&quot; for not following the local custom. If only Mauno had been there to educate Thoreau about Rome :-)

At least Olli didn&#039;t bite and jump on Mauno&#039;s flame-bait bandwagon and Marc is clearly an Anomaly in that crowd. So, they&#039;re not all a bunch of thought control freaks. But, if you want to get along on moodle.org you had better learn the Goose-step comrade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goose-step</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is your problem figaro. You are quoting Thoreau to people who are clearly challenged by the Sunday comic strips. Heavy reading for MK is The Moodle Users Guide and maybe his Pokemon cards. Using Mauno&#8217;s simpleton logic, Thoreau was nothing but an &#8220;idiot&#8221; for not following the local custom. If only Mauno had been there to educate Thoreau about Rome <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>At least Olli didn&#8217;t bite and jump on Mauno&#8217;s flame-bait bandwagon and Marc is clearly an Anomaly in that crowd. So, they&#8217;re not all a bunch of thought control freaks. But, if you want to get along on moodle.org you had better learn the Goose-step comrade.</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goose-step" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goose-step</a></p>
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		<title>By: figaro</title>
		<link>http://educhalk.org/blog/2010/02/moodle-security-censorship-and-trust-an-observation/comment-page-1/#comment-24607</link>
		<dc:creator>figaro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 00:19:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://educhalk.org/blog/?p=756#comment-24607</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;And I apologize for my &quot;flaming&quot; - if you think I am flaming - for some reason I did not feel any heat... ;-)&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Not surprising, the person wielding the flame thrower typically doesn&#039;t feel the heat ;-) 

Apology, half-hearted as it is, accepted. The &quot;meds&quot; reference was in jest -- my apologies if you think it was serious ;-)

I&#039;ll leave you with this:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Thoreau&#039;s world-famous essay, Civil Disobedience, grew out of a night in July 1846 when he was detained in Concord jail for nonpayment of the poll tax. Henry had refused to pay the tax because of its association with the institution of slavery. His maiden Aunt Maria, without asking Thoreau, paid his tax and secured his release. Henry, wanting to continue his protest, was furious. 

&lt;b&gt;Ralph Waldo Emerson is reputed to have visited Thoreau in his jail cell. &quot;Why are you here?&quot; Emerson asked. &quot;Why are you not here?&quot; Thoreau replied.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>And I apologize for my &#8220;flaming&#8221; &#8211; if you think I am flaming &#8211; for some reason I did not feel any heat&#8230; <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p></blockquote>
<p>Not surprising, the person wielding the flame thrower typically doesn&#8217;t feel the heat <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>Apology, half-hearted as it is, accepted. The &#8220;meds&#8221; reference was in jest &#8212; my apologies if you think it was serious <img src='http://educhalk.org/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll leave you with this:</p>
<blockquote><p>Thoreau&#8217;s world-famous essay, Civil Disobedience, grew out of a night in July 1846 when he was detained in Concord jail for nonpayment of the poll tax. Henry had refused to pay the tax because of its association with the institution of slavery. His maiden Aunt Maria, without asking Thoreau, paid his tax and secured his release. Henry, wanting to continue his protest, was furious. </p>
<p><b>Ralph Waldo Emerson is reputed to have visited Thoreau in his jail cell. &#8220;Why are you here?&#8221; Emerson asked. &#8220;Why are you not here?&#8221; Thoreau replied.</b></p></blockquote>
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